加拿大华人论坛 加拿大留学移民关于紧缺职业金融类0111和1111的定位问题：头疼难

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[FONT=宋体]我是在政府部门负责监管银行的，最近十年分别在中国人民银行和中国银监会的分支机构工作，负责对商业银行进行日常监管和特别监管。这些监管工作几乎涉及所监管银行的所有方面。至少包括：对银行各种市场准入事项进行审批许可、现场检查调查或核查银行的各种经营管理情况、分析检查银行的各种会计、统计报表及报告、查处银行违法违规案件、与银行高级管理人员或其他人员进行谈话等。曾经有几年在人民银行会计部门做过一般会计人员。此外，还对几家属于濒临破产的银行进行特别监管和处置。这种工作职责从小的行业来套是监管银行，从大的范围套是金融监管。曾经任过副科长，现在职位是主任科员。[/FONT] [FONT=宋体]但在[/FONT]38[FONT=宋体]紧缺专业里，只有金融类的[/FONT]0111[FONT=宋体]即[/FONT]1111[FONT=宋体]两类，不知道我能否对应具体的职业定位，也不知如何进行选择其项下那么多的具体描述。因为在对其职责做英文翻译时，一个单词有很多不同的译法，如“[/FONT]Financial manager[FONT=宋体]”可以是“金融经理”还是“财务经理”、还可以是“金融管理者”？我从[/FONT]0111[FONT=宋体]和[/FONT]1111[FONT=宋体]两类共[/FONT]159[FONT=宋体]个[/FONT]title[FONT=宋体]中，找出与我实际较能靠边的[/FONT]title[FONT=宋体]有“[/FONT]financial administrator[FONT=宋体]”、“[/FONT]auditor [FONT=宋体]?[/FONT] finance[FONT=宋体]”、“[/FONT]auditors supervisor [FONT=宋体]”“[/FONT]financial auditor[FONT=宋体]”[/FONT] [FONT=宋体]、“[/FONT]officer, financial control [FONT=宋体]”、“[/FONT]supervisor, auditors[FONT=宋体]”等。在审批官眼中，这些[/FONT]title[FONT=宋体]可能有哪些的翻译？不同的译法对自己的定位有重大影响。请教我以哪个职业描述最贴切？能让审判官信服的可能性有多大？　谢谢您的帮助！[/FONT]

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回复: 关于紧缺职业金融类0111和1111的定位问题：头疼难题请教会计Accounting 和 金融Finance是两个不同专业，通常讲：Accountant向controller报告, 负责会计和报告，Finance person向treasurer报告，负责借贷，投资等与资金相关的活动，controller and treasurer向CFO报告。因对Finance不了解，谈些对会计的认识。 Financial Auditor （FA, or External Auditor） 应该是独立第三方专业人士 (CPA Firm)， FA是相对IA （internal Auditor) 而言。IA是对公司内部进行审计，IA的从业者多是CPA，CIA，或其他有会计背景专业人士，对独立性的要求远没有FA强。 会计和审计可以在几乎所有的Industry里工作，无论Title的变化，他们的基本职能依然是会计或审计。Finance manager 是指谁，要根据环境和上下文判断， 若指会计，准确讲是Accounting manager， 通常要求会计学位，CPA资格，GAAP经验及其他。若指金融，Finance manager 较好。 关于级别，staff, senior or supervisor, or even manager, 根据工作合同，选一个最有力的。 以上是本人的粗浅理解，不对之处，请指正。

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回复: 关于紧缺职业金融类0111和1111的定位问题：头疼难题请教2楼的意见很专业，但楼主的问题很难有明晰的答案。能否请专门人士或有经验人员提点意见？因为国外的很多词语或意境可以有很多理解，移民官的审批自由裁量权似乎就很大了。在38项紧缺职业里，多少人为此绞尽脑汁还搞不清楚自己究竟是不是可以靠得上。版主或过来的兄弟姐妹能否给予指点？

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回复: 关于紧缺职业金融类0111和1111的定位问题：头疼难题请教金融财务的紧缺类专业人士，或者是经济类的公务员，难道很少移民吗？请各位提点专业意见吧？?

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回复: 关于紧缺职业金融类0111和1111的定位问题：头疼难题请教我认为你的工作是内部审计，适合1111。

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回复: 关于紧缺职业金融类0111和1111的定位问题：头疼难题请教请看0111和1111的具体阐述：0111：http://www5.hrsdc.gc.ca/NOC/English/NOC/2006/Profile.aspx?val=0&val1=0111 0111 Financial Managers Financial managers plan, organize, direct, control and evaluate the operation of financial and accounting departments. They develop and implement the financial policies and systems of establishments. Financial managers establish performance standards and prepare various financial reports for senior management. They are employed in financial and accounting departments in companies throughout the private sector and in government.Example Titlescontrollerdirector ? financial servicesdirector of accountingfinance directorfinancial administratormanager, financial controlmanager, financial planning and analysismanager, internal audit servicestreasurerView all titlesMain dutiesFinancial managers perform some or all of the following duties:Plan, organize, direct, control and evaluate the operation of an accounting, audit or other financial departmentDevelop and implement the financial policies, systems and procedures of an establishmentPrepare or co-ordinate the preparation of financial statements, summaries, and other cost-benefit analyses and financial management reportsCo-ordinate the financial planning and budget process, and analyze and correct estimatesSupervise the development and implementation of financial simulation modelsEvaluate financial reporting systems, accounting procedures and investment activities and make recommendations for changes to procedures, operating systems, budgets and other financial control functions to senior managers and other department or regional managersRecruit, organize, train and manage staffAct as liaison between the organization and its shareholders, the investing public and external financial analystsEstablish profitability standards for investment activities and handle mergers and/or acquisitionsNotify and report to senior management concerning any trends that are critical to the organization's financial performance.Employment requirementsA bachelor's degree in business administration, economics, commerce or a related field is required.Accounting and audit managers may require a recognized accounting designation (CA, CMA or CGA).A master's degree in business administration (concentration in finance), or another master's level management program may be required.Several years of experience in accounting, auditing, budgeting, financial planning and analysis or other financial activities are required.Additional informationProgression to senior management positions, such as vice-president of finance, is possible with experience.1111：http://www5.hrsdc.gc.ca/NOC/English/NOC/2006/Profile.aspx?val=1&val1=1111 1111 Financial Auditors and Accountants Financial auditors examine and analyze the accounting and financial records of individuals and establishments to ensure accuracy and compliance with established accounting standards and procedures. Accountants plan, organize and administer accounting systems for individuals and establishments. Articling students in accounting firms are included in this unit group. Financial auditors and accountants are employed by auditing and accounting firms throughout the private and public sectors, or they may be self-employed.Example Titlesaccountantcertified general accountant (CGA)certified management accountant (CMA)chartered accountant (CA)chief accountantfinancial auditorincome tax expertindustrial accountantinternal auditorView all titlesMain dutiesFinancial auditors perform some or all of the following duties:Examine and analyze journal and ledger entries, bank statements, inventories, expenditures, tax returns and other accounting and financial records, documents and systems of an individual, department, company or other establishment to ensure financial recording accuracy and compliance with established accounting standards, procedures and internal controlsPrepare detailed reports on audit findings and make recommendations to improve individual or establishment's accounting and management practicesConduct field audits of businesses to ensure compliance with provisions of the Income Tax Act, Canadian Business Corporations Act or other statutory requirementsMay supervise other auditors or professionals in charge of accounting within client's establishment.Accountants perform some or all of the following duties:Plan, set up and administer accounting systems and prepare financial information for an individual, department, company or other establishmentExamine accounting records and prepare financial statements and reportsDevelop and maintain cost finding, reporting and internal control proceduresExamine financial accounts and records and prepare income tax returns from accounting recordsAnalyze financial statements and reports and provide financial, business and tax adviceMay act as a trustee in bankruptcy proceedingsMay supervise and train articling students, other accountants or administrative technicians.Employment requirementsChartered accountants require a university degree and Completion of a professional training program approved by a provincial institute of chartered accountants and, depending on the province, either two years or 30 months of on-the-job training and Membership in a provincial Institute of Chartered Accountants upon successful completion of the Uniform Evaluation (UFE).Certified general accountants and certified management accountants require a university degree and Completion of a training program approved by the Society of Certified General Accountants or Society of Management Accountants and several years of on-the-job training and Certification by the Certified General Accountants Association or the Society of Management Accountants.Auditors require education, training and recognition as indicated for chartered accountants, certified general accountants or certified management accountants and Some experience as an accountant.Auditors may require recognition by the Institute of Internal Auditors.To act as a trustee in bankruptcy proceedings, auditors and accountants must hold a licence as a trustee in bankruptcy.Licensing by the provincial or territorial governing body is usually required for accountants and auditors practising public accounting.Additional informationThere is limited mobility among the three professional accounting designations (CA, CGA and CMA).Progression to auditing or accounting management positions is possible with experience.

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回复: 关于紧缺职业金融类0111和1111的定位问题：头疼难题请教5楼的：楼主的工作应该不是内部审计吧？他不是银行内部的审计，是外部监管部门的监督管理检查。银行监管不是银行经理,更不是银行内部稽核。

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回复: 关于紧缺职业金融类0111和1111的定位问题：头疼难题请教6楼的：我知道那些具体的title,Main duties,我的问题，一是审批官是如何翻译或理解这些title和Main duties的，不同的翻译结果对中国人来说可能是完全不同的职业定位。二是我又应该如何将我的职业定位与这些词语相吻合？三是究竟以大类的名词即0111 Financial Managers 、1111 Financial Auditors and Accountants 为准，还是以里面的title为准？ 这才是问题的核心，请教了。

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回复: 关于紧缺职业金融类0111和1111的定位问题：头疼难题请教官方对NOC的Category的选择，要求如下：If the initial description and list of main duties match what you did at your last job(s), you can use this experience to earn points under the selection factors when you apply as a skilled worker. 根据这段话，Category的定位主要应用初始描述以及主要职责部分。下面是我从initial description找到的主要区别。1111：Financial auditors and accountants are employed by auditing and accounting firms throughout the private and public sectors, or they may be self-employed.我的理解：1111的职位是在第三方的会计事务所或者审计机构。比如我们常说的4大。0111:They are employed in financial and accounting departments in companies throughout the private sector and in government.我的理解：0111的职位是企业内部的会计部门。楼主的职位，只能向0111上靠。我再做一下分析。一个人的工作经验有很多，如果是10年内的经验，且至少1年连续，则可以作为NOC的Category的选择。根据楼主的工作经验，近10年做过三件事情：金融监管、一般会计人员、破产管理。一般会计人员不符合NOC中的38项，不能选择。所以，只能选择金融监管和破产管理，即向1111上靠。1111有两个职位：Financial auditors和Accountants。楼主的金融监管的经历符合Financial auditors，破产管理的经历符合Accountants。下面分别描述。Financial auditors的Main duties有4个内容，需要满足一些（some）或者所有要求： * Examine and analyze journal and ledger entries, bank statements, inventories, expenditures, tax returns and other accounting and financial records, documents and systems of an individual, department, company or other establishment to ensure financial recording accuracy and compliance with established accounting standards, procedures and internal controls * Prepare detailed reports on audit findings and make recommendations to improve individual or establishment's accounting and management practices * Conduct field audits of businesses to ensure compliance with provisions of the Income Tax Act, Canadian Business Corporations Act or other statutory requirements * May supervise other auditors or professionals in charge of accounting within client's establishment.第三个是加拿大的工作内容，不可能满足。第一项最重要，第2、4是第一项的补充。根据第一项的要求，审计的内容需要是会计和财务相关的内容，确保和财务记录的准确，确保和已经制定的会计准则、流程和内部管控的一致。下面分析一下Financial auditors的任职要求：Auditors require education, training and recognition as indicated for chartered accountants, certified general accountants or certified management accountants and Some experience as an accountant.根据这句话，3种类型满足1种即可。1 chartered accountants；2 certified general accountants；3 certified management accountants and Some experience as an accountant1和2的任职要求如下： * Chartered accountants require a university degree and Completion of a professional training program approved by a provincial institute of chartered accountants and, depending on the province, either two years or 30 months of on-the-job training and Membership in a provincial Institute of Chartered Accountants upon successful completion of the Uniform Evaluation (UFE). * Certified general accountants and certified management accountants require a university degree and Completion of a training program approved by the Society of Certified General Accountants or Society of Management Accountants and several years of on-the-job training and Certification by the Certified General Accountants Association or the Society of Management Accountants.1和2的任职要求我认为比较难以满足，因为需要的是加拿大的认证和评估。第3个要求，即认证管理会计，没有详细描述，应该比较容易满足（第3项的Some experience as an accountant，楼主已经满足）。Auditors还有一项要求，如下：Auditors may require recognition by the Institute of Internal Auditors.需要加拿大一个协会的认可不过，这个要求是“可以”，而不是必须。Accountants的职责比较多，而楼主只是符合：May act as a trustee in bankruptcy proceedings。同时这个任职要求：To act as a trustee in bankruptcy proceedings, auditors and accountants must hold a licence as a trustee in bankruptcy.所以，很难符合Accountants的要求。根据以上分析，楼主要把重点放到Financial auditors的三个职责上，同时要有任职要求的一些证明。和职责无关的描述，基本不要涉及。

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回复: 关于紧缺职业金融类0111和1111的定位问题：头疼难题请教官方对NOC的Category的选择，要求如下：If the initial description and list of main duties match what you did at your last job(s), you can use this experience to earn points under the selection factors when you apply as a skilled worker. 根据这段话，Category的定位主要应用初始描述以及主要职责部分。下面是我从initial description找到的主要区别。1111：Financial auditors and accountants are employed by auditing and accounting firms throughout the private and public sectors, or they may be self-employed.我的理解：1111的职位是在第三方的会计事务所或者审计机构。比如我们常说的4大。0111:They are employed in financial and accounting departments in companies throughout the private sector and in government.我的理解：0111的职位是企业内部的会计部门。楼主的职位，只能向0111上靠。我再做一下分析。一个人的工作经验有很多，如果是10年内的经验，且至少1年连续，则可以作为NOC的Category的选择。根据楼主的工作经验，近10年做过三件事情：金融监管、一般会计人员、破产管理。一般会计人员不符合NOC中的38项，不能选择。所以，只能选择金融监管和破产管理，即向1111上靠。1111有两个职位：Financial auditors和Accountants。楼主的金融监管的经历符合Financial auditors，破产管理的经历符合Accountants。下面分别描述。Financial auditors的Main duties有4个内容，需要满足一些（some）或者所有要求：* Examine and analyze journal and ledger entries, bank statements, inventories, expenditures, tax returns and other accounting and financial records, documents and systems of an individual, department, company or other establishment to ensure financial recording accuracy and compliance with established accounting standards, procedures and internal controls* Prepare detailed reports on audit findings and make recommendations to improve individual or establishment's accounting and management practices* Conduct field audits of businesses to ensure compliance with provisions of the Income Tax Act, Canadian Business Corporations Act or other statutory requirements* May supervise other auditors or professionals in charge of accounting within client's establishment.第三个是加拿大的工作内容，不可能满足。第一项最重要，第2、4是第一项的补充。根据第一项的要求，审计的内容需要是会计和财务相关的内容，确保和财务记录的准确，确保和已经制定的会计准则、流程和内部管控的一致。下面分析一下Financial auditors的任职要求：Auditors require education, training and recognition as indicated for chartered accountants, certified general accountants or certified management accountants and Some experience as an accountant.根据这句话，3种类型满足1种即可。1 chartered accountants；2 certified general accountants；3 certified management accountants and Some experience as an accountant1和2的任职要求如下：* Chartered accountants require a university degree and Completion of a professional training program approved by a provincial institute of chartered accountants and, depending on the province, either two years or 30 months of on-the-job training and Membership in a provincial Institute of Chartered Accountants upon successful completion of the Uniform Evaluation (UFE). * Certified general accountants and certified management accountants require a university degree and Completion of a training program approved by the Society of Certified General Accountants or Society of Management Accountants and several years of on-the-job training and Certification by the Certified General Accountants Association or the Society of Management Accountants.1和2的任职要求我认为比较难以满足，因为需要的是加拿大的认证和评估。第3个要求，即认证管理会计，没有详细描述，应该比较容易满足（第3项的Some experience as an accountant，楼主已经满足）。Auditors还有一项要求，如下：Auditors may require recognition by the Institute of Internal Auditors.需要加拿大一个协会的认可不过，这个要求是“可以”，而不是必须。Accountants的职责比较多，而楼主只是符合：May act as a trustee in bankruptcy proceedings。同时这个任职要求：To act as a trustee in bankruptcy proceedings, auditors and accountants must hold a licence as a trustee in bankruptcy.所以，很难符合Accountants的要求。根据以上分析，楼主要把重点放到Financial auditors的三个职责上，同时要有任职要求的一些证明。和职责无关的描述，基本不要涉及。点击展开... 谢谢你的详细而精辟的分析，获益匪浅。 但我咨询一些中介说，我选择会计更稳妥，因为一是那边更需要专业人员，二是我有国内的会计职称证，三是我从事过会计。其实我不论是选择会计还是金融监管，我基本可以得到一些佐证材料，所以，关键是选择哪个职业，在移民官看来更容易审批。或者在移民官眼中选择哪个职业我会更有说服力。

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